Caricature Character WIP for Videoclip

[Mr.T]

well.. this is the very beginning of my project, it will be for a hiphop videoclip i'm preparing (but there is still lots of work to do :D )

putting references:

[Mr.T]

i started the head, need work on nose.. havn't started working on mouth yet..

wip 01:

[Mr.T]

well :D

this is my first wip thread, have a lot of work to do: finishing the head, textures, then starting body..

i hope i'm on the good way (crits are very welcome ;) )

using Max 5.1 and Photoshop 7..

have a lot of probs with the eyebrows.. still working on it (didn't put it yet cause it looks pity for me :D )

eee.. i think that's it..

[MonteCristo]

Well, it's a solid start, but there are a couple of things you must resolve. Firslty, yes the eyebrows are in need of work, they need to be more pronouced, and furrowed, this will achieve a more menacing look, that I think you need to go for. Also, you need to get the jawline correct. Pay attention to where the jaw comes up around the neck and meets theneck, at the moment, the definition is not there. Keep at it! :D

[Mr.T]

hehe, i was just thinkin' about it when i checked the picz before putting it in the thread (i was thinking.. hmmm.. weird jaw :D :D )
you're absolutely right! i'm gonna work on it.

actually there is no eyebrows, i'm still not sure how i'll make it.. (i mean, shag-hair or texture..)

thanks ;)

[MonteCristo]

Sorry, my bad, I didn't mean the eybrows, rather, the brow itself, where the eybrows sit. The reference picture shows a very heavy brow far forward of the eyes, it helps to give that menacing look you need.

[DoperMan]

ela re T. pos paei? poli kali arxi mporo na po. an kai me to Global illumination den fenontai toso kala oi anomalies tou prosopou, giauto an thes mia kali kritiki kalitera einai na baleis ena raytrace material i apla ena opoiodipote gialistero material.

this is indeed a very solid foundation, but in order for us to give you more critics maybe you should use a reflective material and maybe post a wireframe.

best luck and keep us updated.

[Mr.T]

MonteCristo-3DT: i think i fixed the jaw thing, it looks more natural now ;) and i enhanced the brows ( i didn't enhanced too much by the way, if u believe it needs more please tell me )

DoperMan: xexe, xeromai poly poy tha exw kai mia eliniki apopsi s'afto to project ;) afto to clip tha perasei sto mad tv g'afto prepei na dosw ta kalitera poy exw, to kalo einai oti den exw sigkikrimeno deadline ( doylevw ala clip mazi )

i didn't clearly understand what u meant about reflective material ( u were talking about shiny.. or simply reflective? ) i attach a picture of the head without mapping ( with a shiny material ) hope it helps a little bit..

[Mr.T]

another render.. i made many modification (but maybe this is not easy to check :D )

still need lots of work.

the upper render are with no lights

[Mr.T]

hem... still wondering how can i make good looking eyebrows.. can u please help me? (somebody?)

[DoperMan]

mi mou peis oti eixes balei to xeraki sou sto videocilp tou lektikou ? An ne mporo na po oti ekanes mia poli kali douleia.

The only problem i can spot is where his nostril meets his cheek, i think you should put some space between them. Oh and another thing the lower lip seems to be overwelmingly exagurated.

[Mr.T]

DoperMan: nai egw ekana to clip toy lektiko (vasika egw kanw ola ta clip toy lektiko kai toy bcc ), endaksei den htan tipota spoydaiw (enw sxetika aplo htan to clip den eixe kinisei sthn camera otan eixe o lektikos, den htan arketa megalo to blue screen gia na kanoyme tracking, distixos..) ala xerome poly poy soy arese :D :D
pandos egine se poly mikri diarkeia xrono g'afto pistevw ean eixa perisotero xrono tha htan kalitero.. anyway to clip poy doylevw topa prepei na ta dosw ola :halo:

yes, i believe that the lower lips needs work too ;) (lektikos told me that too :D )

i didn't clearly understand about the nostril, can u be more clear?
do u mean larger nose? sorry didn't get it :hmm:

[Downup]

the skin are very strange in color .

but it lookes good!

[DeadSquirrel]

It's odd, there's something not right, but it's probably very small.
It's making the difference of the "tough guy" on your pic, and the "gentle naive boxer" on your model...

maybe the eyes are too small and close to each other on your model? And also something to do with the arcades (eyebrow bones :p ).

Faces always scared me and fascinated me in that way... it depends of just one small "invisible" detail, and a face can change dramatically. 1mm here, 1mm there...

Oh, and if you want to make a caricature, you'll have to be exagerating a lot more.
Take the most visual features, like the nose and eyebrows, and exagerate them, a lot..
have fun :D


edit:
Import the picture in the scene, and make your model transculent before overlapping it.
Try to give your head the exact same position as in the picture.
It's the only way you can spot certain errors, like the distance eye-ear... it's possible the model's upper face is too long.

[DoperMan]

What i said about the nostril is that the skin is attached with skin in the cheek (sto magoulo).

Parepiptontos ego doulepsa stin Magicon gia kapoio diastima se projects opos to arkoudaki tis Coca Cola, kapoia ksena video-clip kai bebea tin "Politiki Kouzina"

[Mr.T]

DeadSquirrel: i believe you'r 100% right, sometimes it's the little thing that changes everything! (i clearly understand this when i started making the face texture..)

for the caricature thing, i started to make him like a caricature but i don't know why, suddently they told me to be soft on exagerating :roll: , well it must be 3d but not realistic.. like caricature cartoonish realistic 3d.. (errr.. :D )

Doperman: you'r absolutely right, i just understood what you were talking about :D , i'm on it right now. i'm also doing the texture and it's a real nightmare (i never tried to make someone's 3d character.. well i did me but it was cartoonish and very caricatural :roll: )

where can i see some of your work? i'm very interested. where are you actually working at?

[Mr.T]

i made the texture (still needs work on it) i changed a lot the head and i started the body (it will be clothes and not as the reference, i'll post it when i'll be more satisfied about it ;) )

crits please (this my first head texture i've ever made.. have a lots of things to fix.. the eyebrows are kind of weird i think..)

[Gl2eEn]

I must say i like the character, nicely done :)

[Mr.T]

well, forgot to mention that the videoclip will not have big close up of the head..

[Mr.T]

thanx a lot Gl2eEn :D but i'm sure i have at least a thousand things to do till i'll got satisfied :roll:

i have to work on the texture a lot ;)

[Mr.T]

some update of the head and playing with max morpher..

[Gl2eEn]

yay! he can move his eyes now :D keep it coming dude.. :)

[Mr.T]

some update

[Mr.T]

i didn't mention that the hand and clothes are not textured yet..
i also have the shoes to make.

pants must be larger also..

[Gl2eEn]

:D that pic made me laugh, NOT coz of the way how he look like, just coz of exprasion on his face :P


cant wait to see it done budd, i mean i really like him :D

[Mr.T]

i understand what you mean, maybe i have to change the expression on his face (for us to be more focused on the rest of the body :D :D )

hehe ;)

[Mr.T]

render from another angle.. don't know why but i think his look is pretty intimidating :roll:

[Phynius Gauge]

Hahaha that guy looks wasted! Very good model though. The lips look a little funky. Maybe its just me. Oh the clothing looks good too.

[j_mac]

it looked ruff before. but i like the status.

wicked.

[Daniel]

lol he really looks drugged up that's for sure

[Mr.T]

well, i was starting to worry about this forum, i'm glad it's back! woohoo :D

i have continued my character, made a lots of change in the body (proportions mainly) also changed the cloth a little bit, now i'm gonna start texturing the cloth..

the hands are still without map too, head is finished (i think it's done.. or almost done ;) )

still have lots of thing to do..

[Mr.T]

-

[Mr.T]

and the texture i did for the face..

[Mr.T]

well not much reply to help me :p

please can u post crits for the clothes? i'm curious about your opinion ;)

this is weird but i have some problems with max light tracer.. i have no idea why but the exposure kinda act weird, when i change the intensity of the cloth color (for example from white to black) the exposure gets very high (with linear and automatic exposure).. i have not that much experience in light tracer if someone could help me that would be very nice :D

need to texture theses hands..

crits please (i want to improve it as much as i can)

[Mr.T]

small stupid compositing to test the rigging :D need work on the arm area. ;)

[Cracadoo]

Hi!!! It's wery good work but i cant see why it is named "caricature". Humor me and make his head reely huge or somepthing. Also clotes have too strong (hi volume) colors, i think.

[LOUcifer]

nice job! I personally like him with hair. To me, he looks like a flashy kind of guy, maybe add a fat necklace or maybe a logo on the jumpsuit. Very sweet though!

[goat]

hey mr. t looks really good. i agree about the hair. also a PHAT neckless would be a nice touch. make a morph for his face though. he needs to have a diff expression. keep it up man.

[Mr.T]

Cracadoo: well yes, it started as a caricature :roll: (but in the meanwhile i have been told to do not make him too much caricatural..to finally making him more realistic but it still had to be looking like 3d.. errr.. i hope you understood what i tried to explain :D )

i too do not like that much the cloth.. i have to work on a better style.. (logo and stuff on it) thanx for you c&c!

LOUcifer: thanx! :D well i don't know why but the hair is.. not following the head :eek: ! have to read shag hair help to understand why it does this to me (or maybe someone could help me telling me why :roll: )

goat: thanx :D i'am quite affraid about the neckless idea because it will be for a videoclip and i don't have that much experience in reactor or dynamic stuff (i mean for collision between neckless - body) but now that you told me that i'm really really thinking about implementing one (+the person i'm doing in 3d has made his own neckless ;) )

before making any morph target i would like to rigg him better (i'm having huge problems in the elbow area but i'm gonna fix it)
but soon i will make morph target for sure! ;)

thanx a lot for your c&c!! :D

[Mr.T]

just to show where i'm actually working on (rigging.. starts to be painfull :D ) i'm trying to make a nice rigging on the elbow area (because for the moment it's really ugly)..

[Mr.T]

i believe it's better with blue clothes..

[Mr.T]

closer render.. pockets are not finished so don't look at it ;)

[DoperMan]

Oreos re Mr. T blepo pos exeis poli emepiria pano sto video making tsecara kai to site sou kai xarika pou tetoiou tipou douleia ginete epi prosopikou epipedou se apla home pc's.

The blue colors are really much better. they suite him a lot, but the china red color is an aggressive color that could suit such a badboy personna.

as much as the rigging problems you have encountered .. well i wish you luck

[Mr.T]

first of all thanx for your good words i really appreciate ;)

hmmm... maybe you're right but i don't know why the red one didn't made the effect i was expecting to, the person himself that i'm making in 3d told me that it would be nice if i could do it red-yellow as showed in the previous render cause he's doing kick boxing (and was world champion in freefight-cage fight as Andy The Ant), he's got a kick-boxing suit (Muai Thai) with these colors that's the reason.. but i don't know why i really like the blue one.. i'm seriously thinking about it :D

i'll also make him a nice cap ;)

for the rigging prob., well thank you cause i'll need it :D :D

[Mr.T]

well.. it's a stupid question but.. anyone has an idea why the shag-hair is not following the head?????

hmm.. weird thing :roll:

[Mr.T]

anyone?

i'm using biped and physique, when i rotate bones like the head or chest all is ok, shag hair stays on the head.. but when i move the whole character the hair stays behind (like there where some problem with pivot or something, i move the character and the hair move but with a delay)

does anyone knows why it's doing this to me?

i'll try deleting the hair and making it again.. hope it'll solve my problem.

i've almost fixed my rigging problem with the arms, i'll put some renders tonight ;)

thanx

[nookie]

i'm not sure but... maybe you have lo link the shag geometry (you can see the name in the shag rollout) to the biped... hope this help, but probably is just something really stupid ;)

[Cracadoo]

Sorry, dude i cant help you with rig and hair problems. I wanted to say that i reely like blue outfit but man seems to know what he wants. Do what you think you should do...

[Mr.T]

nookie: i tried to link it to the head bone but it still doing this to me (whyyyyy? whyyyyy...) i'm sure too that it must be something really stupid and easy to do.. but i have to find what it is and that is the difficult part :roll:

Cracadoo: ..Do what you think you should do.. well.. right now i want to kill myself :D (nervs! nervs! ;) ) haha

thanx for your opinion, well i like the blue one too ;)

--

sorry i couldn't post any render for the reason that i had the update at work and forget to bring it home... (silly me :roll: )

[akash]

hey dude here are a few tips while working with Shag:

when u create shage hair.. 1st u create splines.. if u wish u can link those splines to the biped head bone.. this way the shag will move with the character..
or u can do one more thing..
get into the FIGURE MODE... there make sure your splines are properly aligned.... next go to the SHAG:HAIR PARAMETERS window... (environment) and look for
FIX HAIR: catagorie..
there tick on : SHAPE and Density both.. and set the REFERENCE FRAME to '0'
now u can start animating the character.. but always keep the '0' frame as the same BIPED GYM POSE.. this way it'll take shape and density info form '0' frame and follow it throughout the animation..
to do this u can 1st make your animation and finally copy the GYM POSE from biped FIG MODE.. and paste it to the '0' frame while SWITCHING ON the ANIMATE BUTTON..
i'm sure it'll work..
we've done entire projects like this.. u can even use this for character with full body fur..(like CAT,DOG,BEAR..)

hehe.. enjoy.. your character it coming out really good.. keep on working..
cya

[Mr.T]

first of all i would like to thank you for your great help! the fun part is that i just discover today the fix shape/density tickers in shag hair (i found it in the help) and i was coming to post that i finally found it :D :D but you had some tips that is very usefull for me!

thanx a lot, i really appreciate!

[Mr.T]

some extrem breakdancing poses to test the rigging :)

[Mr.T]

-

[Mr.T]

is it me or the wrist area is a little bit odd?

maybe it's too rotated.. dunno..

[Mr.T]

i'm doing some test with morpher and rigging. here is a very small facial test animation. very quick test.

facial test animation DivX5.0.5 / 380Kb (http://www.multimania.com/kusocrewdynasty/pview.html)

[bullethead]

I agree with you on the wrist area. It does look a bit odd. This is my first time checking out this thread. I must say this is some amazing work you are doing...might I ask what hip hop artist this is for since I really cant recognize his face?

[DoperMan]

den ksero re mr.T parolo pou gamei kai spernei fenete san na exei parei tripaki sto video... lol ti na po.

very good indeed but there is something wrong with him.

[Mr.T]

bullethead: i'm actually trying to soften the wrist area cause it really annoys me (and i'm not the only one apparently ;) )

thanx a lot for your good words (this my first try representing a real person), his artist name is LEKTIKOS, he's greek (but he spend several years in usa/belgium/holland) you can get further info at http://www.lektikos.tv/en/bcc_eng.html (sorry for the bad english.. i wroted this section and i'm not that good at translating stuff :roll: ). I hope one day you'll hear about him ;)

Doperman: can you be more precise on what is annoying you? it will be easier for me to modify :D maybe the upper teeth that do not appear annoys you?

thanx a lot

[Mr.T]

another question.. is it necessary to make the tongue? (cause that black hole in the mouth is not that nice..)

i'm really wondering if i have to do it.. (+ it might be a little harder to animate..)

[bullethead]

yeah a tounge would work really good cause im assuming he will be rapping in the video. LEKTIKOS. hmm that does sound familiar Im gonna have to find his cd next time I go shopping for some. I think the problem with the wrist isnt the wrist. Its the sweatsuit near that wrist. Thats what really looks odd to me.

[Mr.T]

bullethead: yes, normally the sweat must fall on the hand and not take the hands shape.. i'll try to fix that, thanx a lot! ;)

well if you want to take a cd from LEKTIKOS i'm recommending you to wait for his next lp coming on April (i'm sure it will be really great) if you want i'll keep you informed on this one ;)

[Mr.T]

well, today, for many reasons, i decided to quit my job. but i don't like to start things and don't finish it, so i'll make an animation with this character..

i believe that next week i'll have some scenes to show..

hem.. well... holidays from now ;)

ps: have to find a new job now..