Dominance War V - 3D - ? - gestis

[gestis]

OMG, I do realy need a luck on this one...

[paulius-st]

problems with idea generation???
this should help you
http://www.gameartisans.org/forums/showthread.php?t=19450

best wishes and good luck with this :) .
i'll ceep an eye for updates :)

[gestis]

Thanks, Paulius. There are useful links out there. But after that brainwash I'm still okay.

[paulius-st]

you're wellcome. have an idea or a direction yet?

[gestis]

My "god" will originate from human. I allready have the story, but I'll post it later along with progress.

These starting images represent dynamic, semi-abstract shapes - the only thing I'm worried about right now, also possible material combinations where one color meets another.

[paulius-st]

nice thumbnails. i like 7'th and 9'th .

its interesting whats going to come out of this :)

[gestis]

I have done some refinement on those previous sketches, but idea remains the same, though.

[Rych]

I love the idea of whatever it is encapsulated in gel or crystal, very neat!

[discmage]

Thats actually a really cool dynamic concept generation...Submit that to the 2D challenge and your done! Good job. Congrats for finishing :)

I like the middle left on the first batch, bottom left on the second :)

[dhin]

I like the second one on the top. It just looks the most interesting to me.

[gestis]

Thank you, colleagues! Actually I'm leaning towards that blue scorpion(?) thing. But none of them looks goddish to me. lol

Have to do more thinking :wall:

[capitan_popo]

I like the top right as well...the scorpion looks cool also...but you would have to add something to it so its not just a giant scorpion

[SnappedStrings]

Nice concepts, I like the idea of keeping it as abstract as you can for as long as possible. I'm with you on the scorpion thing, plus I think a cool color scheme would work well. Also agree that the scorpion doesn't come across as a God character. Perhaps instead the scorpion is ridden by the actual God? Or he could pull his chariot or something maybe.

Or maybe a better idea would be to stop thinking of it as a scorpion, and keep thinking of it as just a really cool shape. Then you could turn it around in your head, maybe sketch it from a few different angles, and realize that it's actually a great shape for a shield or something. You know, just find a nice way to incorporate it into your design.

Also, I like the first and second forms on your latest concepts, I'd like to see more exploration on those too.

Hope this helps! Nice work

[gestis]

Thanks, SnappedStrings. We are thinking almost the same direction. :)

But I think it's time to clear some things and put few major definitions to the story. I have already mentioned that my "god" descended from human. Also new technology achievements in every branch of science (genetics, electronics, engineering etc.) and military based potitics and economy direction that way made a step or two in human evolution. So now humans does not look like previous humas (like we are), but differ in many aspects. They have stronger body and endurance in harsh surroudings, their skin protected by naturally occured armored plates like exoskeletons (i also add some mechanical armor over that too)...... Demons, magic and other mystical things does not exist in this story.

So its war and final battle. And the only victorious warrior will be granted as the God. At the begining they teaming together, but at the end every one fighting for his own survival and dominion.

And that is my story in short. Hope you guys like it. :)

[gestis]

I have made this base mesh to help with sketching. This is not the mesh I'm going to sculpt from, but the one I will paint over. Just to ease my life.

Btw, I'v choosed that "scorpion" guy since he have the tail which is very important attribute. This tail supposed to render nuclear explosion waves to wipe out everything around.

[miclepickle]

Nice, I like where this is going.

[paulius-st]

last concepts looks interesting. have nothing to coment yet . i'll wait till first progress comes :) .

[gestis]

I have made a few sketches and they look almost identical. So I'll just jump into ZBrush and continue sketching in 3d space. That shoul be ok, since I have already set general direction and style of the character. And if nothing will happen in few hours, I'll scratch it.

I also may change the story somewhat 'cause I discovering new perspectives during the process.

[Rytis]

could u tell wich skech did u choose? cuz i love ur skeches. especialy first ones. looks so stylish. i hope we see progres soon;)

[gestis]

I'm not sure anymore. I have trashed a lot of things. I will keep sketching till I get something decent to my taste. :wall:

And you should join us too, for your own good.

[Rytis]

i know, but i have no time at all for that big project as this:) so i will be with ur folks and give my suport till the end:)

[gestis]

ZB sketching :wall::wall::wall:

[paulius-st]

hmmm, looks interesting. his back reminds me of a old game shown in the secon pic :D. i see you are strugling with ideas. i think this could be of some help as a inspiration
http://ceco.cgsociety.org/gallery/879463/
http://cghub.com/images/view/40638/

[gestis]

Thanks! I'll see the way how to put in use that.

I know what I want, just checking adequte means to do that.

[gestis]

I gues I must show entire WIP progress. So I have just collected few more desperate tries in one sheet. Well... here you go.:xx:

[gestis]

Lastly have ZSphered yet another mesh to play with.

[frostsnake]

like those backplates and those energy things. looks sweet.
keep updating:)

[redonix76]

Nice progress! He's looking better and better with each update! I think you're going into the right direction for sure so keep at it!

[aUGIS]

Looks great, keep up the good work :)

[paulius-st]

the last concept mesh looks promising. i see lots of potential in it. but what is that thnig sticking betvien his legs? a godly weapon :D ?

[wil_himura]

I quite like the idea of the last sketch. Let's see how long you stick with it because I'm interested on how would you handle a scorpion alike shape with fingers on the extremities :) Maybe something similar to a Geeko hehe don't know.

[Rytis]

ya. last skech looks realy more agresive. i allways had a weaknes on more than two hands:) good work keep it up

[gestis]

Thanks, guys, for the posts. :)

Looks like I have just discovered one more god. Aftermatch the huge turtle walks the Earth carring big bell on his back... Divine sound of the bell restores everything what was lost during the man destructive actions. Well, that is my new story. :)

Btw, can anyone advice with the dilemma.:wave: Previously I was working on some kind creature (the image is just above). But to convince that he/it is a god, you must put some serious words. Meanwhile, this turtle looks godlike already to me. So I would like to go with this last picture.

[miclepickle]

the turtle is a fun design... but I think I like the scorpion better as a god...

[Puckducker]

Yes! Love the turtle design, definitely stick with that one. The scorpion is a bit more "aggressive", but honestly, there are going to be so many aggressive designs in DWar that going the exact opposite route is going to do well to separate you from the pack.

Nice stuff, really like it.

[miclepickle]

its true that the turtle will really stick out as original :D

[zugok]

I really like the turtle idea as well

[paulius-st]

+1 for the turtle god. :) . it realy is one of the most original designs in this contest :)

[koyima]

Turtle is better than scorpion, but you should develop the turtle further too. I think it's a bit too cudly now.

[gestis]

Thaks, for comments and suggestions. All C&C are welcome at any time. :)

Well, have gathered some references for the turtle to help with sculpting and concepting, also made the base mesh. Some materials for reference comes from here: http://www.naturephoto-cz.com/ others - Googled.

http://img683.imageshack.us/img683/9524/treferences.jpg (http://img683.imageshack.us/i/treferences.jpg/)

[paulius-st]

nice reference. i like the aligator turtles most :) . they look evil and they can bite your arm off. but i wonder...... what words did you typed in google to get the lower rigt image of turtles making jiggy jiggy??? :D

[koyima]

This one for sure.

[washka]

Nice concept so far, keep it up!

[gestis]

I feel you, guys, about that "devil" turtle, but it is a little bit opposite what I'm after. As a rough example those two guys at the bottom (in reference image) should work for me. I'm not going to exactly replicate them, just keep them in mind.

[wil_himura]

Great work mate!!!

This concept is just so awesome... I read some posts ago that you have some doubts on how to make this kind and at the same time great, divine. I'd focus on the tower.
Do you remember the white city in LOTR? This city is epic and you can see it in the first pano view of it shown in the movie:

http://www.stueagon.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/Lord-of-the-Rings-Minas-Tirith.jpg

That white marble look makes it look epic. Maybe an old and wise look on the turtle in combination with a light epic tower just works.

[gestis]

Thanks, wil_himura!

Actually, I have been thinking about cristalization of the shell into diamond or other translucen/transparent cristal. But I'm not sure if real time engines will able to handle it. I mean bending of light, index of refraction/reflection (IOR). In that case I definitely go with white marble, pearl or something of that kind. Thanks for advice, really!

[mix_mash]

Maybe you could have gone a different way and made the turtle gigantic and have small buildings on his shell to show how massive he is. It would make him more god-like. Also, check of images of the Adamantoise from various Final Fantasy games for design ideas.

Paul
(mix_mash)

[paulius-st]

nice progress. i agrea with mix_mash. givin a gigantic castle or citie to its shell would give the sence of scale to the god.

[Pockets]

I agree with mix and paulius as well. I like the big bell tower, and it'd be neat to still have something like it as a central building, but having a city on its back would definitely give it a more grandiose scale and thus a god like feel.

[Cordero]

+1 on the city idea

good luck

[wil_himura]

Yeah, +1 for the city having the bell as the higher end great detail of a castle with more balconies and such. This entry will be hard to beat mate ;)

[gestis]

mix_mash, you are right - that would be a new direction. I could imagine the idea right now - big pointing rock or shell with spiraling walls toward the top and scaterred little houses around. That would increase size of the turtle just monstrously. But I'm not sure if that would make it more godlike. Since god's power comes from inside, wisdom, divine materials etc. If the caracter should be general, let's say, when size and raw power are more important attributes, 'couse he using that directly. Besides, new concept would change the story - who should live in such "walking" town? Pure souls, I guess. But still - that would be dead town anyway. There is one more thing I really like in the current concept - material transition from shell to some kind cristal as turtles shell parts seamlesly transforms into bricks/bloks. Also, the maps max size are 2K, so you won't be able to render nice closeups and general view may look just noisy.

Anyway, I'll keep that concept reserved. But right now I really love this current, more humble, idea.

wil_himura, my goal is just like yours - I want to get it done from start to finish. So, there is no need to beat me, that is my first comp afterall ;)

[miclepickle]

I actually like the single tower... its more comedic than having a village on his back..


he is looking great btw.

[mix_mash]

Suit yourself. The sculpting looks nice so far. In regards to god-likeness, I'm afraid that for this comp it will be the superficial. Meaning that people will see the outside of something and judge godhood by appearance, unfortunately. Most people would have preconceptions of a god being large and/or powerful. While it is important to 'break the mold' and give people new ideas what things should be, people have the tendency to slip into old ways of thinking about things. In order to sell an idea, sometimes you need to pander to average ideals.

I'm not trying to sway you to change your design. I'm just giving an insight on how people can sometimes think.

Still, just keep doing whatever you want to do and be proud of it anyway.

I look forward to see the progress.

Paul
(mix_mash)

[wil_himura]

Hi, looking nice!

about what mix_mash said, I was thinking on Gods yesterday, in fact, we make Gods look like we wan (except for the ones to which their God's did talk in the past :D). Possibilities are masive. But I think that it's hard to make something really different to what ppl expect and do it outstanding. If you help ppl by making it look a bit like they are used to, the concept will be much more believable. I don't know if I explained myself well... just some thoughts!

[Rytis]

wow:) this fellow going bit ugly, i like it:)

[Crispy4004]

The legs were looking a bit off to me, so I got you some anotomical references:

http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/3034/galapagosturtleskeleton.jpg
http://img851.imageshack.us/img851/8764/5093411399ecdf85c951.jpg
http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/819/tortoiseskeleton.jpg

Your knee is way too low. It's actualy located in more of what you would assume to be the shoulder on first glance, which of course is actually deeper inside the shell.

Also here is a little something to look at (http://eoincannon.blogspot.com/2009/11/galpagos-giant-tortoise-wip-3.html) for motivation sake.

[gestis]

Crispy4004, thanks a lot!!!

[koyima]

I see you are going for a more monstrous look in the end.

About the tower: the smaller buildings would give a better sense of scale, right now you can't tell.

[gestis]

I see you are going for a more monstrous look in the end.

I'll try not to create monster. It still gonna be "grass eater" and not predator. Adding those pseudo-teeth to get some weird and archaic look. Also may add some spikes all over the body... And this guy should be very old - as the Earth itself.

Btw, tortoises have evolved from crocodiles or smth, so, I may "borrow" some parts from them as well as lizards, iguanas and other reptiles.

[capitan_popo]

really like the turtle idea....the shell is looking a little cartoony at the moment...but crispy there seems to have looked up some good reference so that should help...really liking the model and concept though gonna keep my eye on it

[koyima]

teeth like this are clearly for eating flesh, animals that eat plants have flat - as opposed to pointy - teeth.

[washka]

There was some nice movie with big turtles from Terry Pratchett's book, discworld.

http://lafoireauxlivres.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/atuin.gif?w=500&h=392

[koyima]

i have actually designed a turtle with ancient ruins , locked in an underwater lake in a cave for a game (well about half way through the game), but the game was cancelled... part of the ruins was a turtle command throne in which the heroine of the game (1 out of two), controlled the turtle, via her telepathic abilities to the land of Telchines (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telchines). You initially though you were on a lake island, until you jumped in the water and swam around it.

pitty i can't share my sketches (due to NDA)

[gestis]

The pose should be somehow similar to these guys:
http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/5461/twoguys.jpg (http://img837.imageshack.us/i/twoguys.jpg/)

As you can see, they can raise their front end pretty high.

Quick and dirty way have changed general proportions in Photoshop so, the second version looks better now, I think. And #1 is how it looked before that.

[wil_himura]

No 1. No 2 reminds me of a turtle a friend had, we used to show it a tomato and the turtle used to pose just like that :P

I think that the base pose is No1, and you could always pose it to No 2 if the action asks for it.

Isn't the bell standing with 0º rotation? right now it's at like 15º. ( \| )I know it may be hard to achieve a believable pose and at the same time a perfect straight tower. Did I explain myself well?

[setschaos]

I really like the idea you are going for here! The only comment I would have is that the anatomy does not speak volumes to what it is doing. Because his legs and long and skinny and his head (relatively) small, it makes the building look light.

I guess the first thing that comes to my mind is the turtle ancient that Ang meets in one of the last episodes of Avatar: The Last Airbender.

[washka]

-Upper part of the head is flat, with a bump on the back of the skull.
-Neckpart go from large to thin, not vice versa, skin folds.
-The plastron is really characteristic and can be articulated.
-Considering the real scale, the shell is bigger, except if you stylize.

Can you see that? :)

Water or earth turtle, earth?

[gestis]

:) Yes, I can see that, washka! But as I already have mentioned many thounsands years ago, I would not mimic it. I'll use it as a starting point and then play with various ideas, shapes, materials. Of course, there should be some logical moments like, setschaos, mentioned. And thats all. Everything else will be pure fantasy product.

wil_himura, I'm not going pose my turtle like the second guy in the image nor make him jump, hang in the ear or anything else. This image shows maximum lengh of legs he can pull out of the shell. :)

So, thanks everyone, who trying to help one or other way. Cheers!

[washka]

Hmm, a pure fantasy product, that's some paradoxical idea impo.

But hey! It doesn't matter.
Hope you won't mind some little tortuga speedie?
Let's have fun!
Gl and keep it up man!

[gestis]

I think, this is the last piece of this concept, so I'm not going develope it any further. Just don't like how it's turning out.

I'll start from scratch... again :wall: But idea remains the same - tortoise with belfry on his back...

[Rytis]

ow its cool i think:) its going grate:)

[gestis]

Ryti, geras pastebejimas... Dekui! ;)

wip:

http://img844.imageshack.us/img844/5351/gestis15.jpg (http://img844.imageshack.us/i/gestis15.jpg/)

[gestis]

Well, setting up general masses...

[Crispy4004]

Your tortoise just needs to find his inner killer. Lower that head down, raise that back, bulk up those muscles, and make him look like he is ready to charge you.:

http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/6453/galapagos20giant20torto.jpg
http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/6040/galapagosgianttortoise0.jpg
http://img858.imageshack.us/img858/866/58237937pintaislands.jpg
http://img848.imageshack.us/img848/9451/galapagosgianttortoisee.jpg

And none of this sort of wimpy stuff ;) :

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/3196/galapagostortoise114520.jpg
http://img695.imageshack.us/img695/5808/tortoiseloribig.jpg

[wil_himura]

I quite like the new "backpack" ;)

[gestis]

I refined search on Galapagos and Aldabros tortoises and found a lot of good stuff by Googling. So, thanks, Crispy4004, you made me refink most things. I'm not gonna make him killer, though, but definitely try to add more expressive and dynamic look. Also found one tortoise by name George. He is the last specimen of his kin. Female was hunted down by some guys, so now he is a walking fossil. He have crearly pointy shell. I think he is in your first or third image or here: http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01447/GEORGE_1447770c.jpg So, I'll use him as a starting point.

wil_himura, thanks! But I'm not sure if my tortoise will like it too. :D If he slip accidentally and wake up on his side, he will need air support - helicopters or cranes - that will rise him back on his feet. :D

...

I think, the tower should be taller and large. But the biggest headache - to make "seamles" transition from tortoise shell structure to towers stone structure.:wall:

[paulius-st]

looking good man :) . i like the new tower.

[koyima]

I'm glad you are leaning towards making him aggressive, it is a battle after all.

[gestis]

Well, I'm glad too, that finally everything comming together.

It's minor update, but I'd definitely want to go this way:

[wil_himura]

I find your tower architecture too modern. I don't know if this is a right born God, but if it's an old creature, the tower should have an oldish look. I don't know if this could help, but look at this Rivendel model:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_LHA-O8oYD3E/TAR2_PUSArI/AAAAAAAAAJY/_E6G2c4wZfQ/s1600/P1010260.JPG.jpeg

[gestis]

Thanks! Right now it have baroque stile - more or less. Rivendel could be gothic or neo-gothic style with mixed elements from other styles. Right now most elements are just placeholders, so i'll be adding details later. Not sure how much that will change the towers style, though. But when I'll run ZBrush over it, it definitely will look old, veeeery old.

[gestis]

I can't shape tortoises shell or body until I'll have semi-compleeted version of architecture piece. So, I'll be doing that right now...

[paulius-st]

looking good. ceep it up :)

[washka]

http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/...E_1447770c.jpg

George is still alife? xD xD xD
I bet this old "last one of its specie" fat*ss still doesn't want to reproduce.
xD xD xD
I bet those biologist intented everything, from viagra to Crazy horse, but still...
This old George was sooo turtle!
xD xD xD
You made my day with this ref... I'm bent with laughter.

[gestis]

George is still alive ;) Just got new "toy" to worry:

[Pockets]

that's looking great, I'd like to see some statues or gargoyles on that bad boy or something...just a suggestion :D

[wil_himura]

Loving the new tower ;)

Great job gestis!

[paulius-st]

tower look great :) . and i will second the gargoyle idea :) .

[Warlock 279]

I agree with them. That is a really nice tower, and some gargoyles would kick it up even another level yet. You don't have to get carried away with fancy gargoyles, just the most basic ones will do nicely.

For example, where you've got those quarter arc four prong things hanging done, right about the window to the bell, those would make excellent gargoyles.

[gestis]

Thanks for suggestions! I may add those gargoyles later, if you so "insist". ;) And ,Warlock 279, I totally agree with you about that place! There should be some hanging frogs with horns. :) Right now I need to push tortoise himsel to the same level of details. Also big headache is to make transition of shapes from shell to stone and material cristalization along with that.

But still, 2K maps and one UV space are fairly low for details. The final image size may look just like this one in this post. Maybe little bigger, but not much. Also, I'm not sure if I'll grab all silhouette with 12K faces.

Btw, I'll be aging the tower pretty heavily, so most edges may be well rounded - that should help with that silhouette problem a little bit.

This image shows possible transition of materials. And ignore those collors for now - just fooled around.

[gestis]

~update:

[paulius-st]

looking better and better with each update :) .
i have a suggestion - it would look better if the scaleds of shell would get smaller when closser to the building - this would give this tower a better integration to the shell. and some plants or root growing from a shell to the tower. this should give your turtle more atient look and give more detail to look at.
something like this http://www.efoto.lt/node/523124

[E4sY]

Looks pretty good. the wrinkles in the fleshy parts is coming along nicely. :)

[gestis]

Thx, I'm glad somebody likes it.;P

Paulius, I do agree about that, but at the moment I do not like the shell itself :(

I'll be aging the architecture part up to this level, I guess:

[gestis]

Hi,

The tower is almost completed. Just need to add some noise on metal parts and finish the "frog". The architecture parts that look unscuplted will be replaced with sculpted ones - this way I will save same UV space.

Guess I jump to the tortoise now.

[Pockets]

thats looking real nice, lovin the gargoyles and details you got in there.

[Rytis]

ohh my:) lots of detales. looks nice so far... i hope u. will not have problems with low poly

[gestis]

Thanks for stopping by. :)

Got new upgrades for shell. Still a little work left, though.

[wil_himura]

I'm liking it ^^

I'm sure you've hundreds of ref pictures, anyways, look at this indonesian temple:
http://www.viajesaindonesia.com/wp-content/uploads/prambanan-indonesia-en-JAVA.jpg

[Martin_x]

New shell looks amazing. Great job!

[gestis]

wil_himura - thanks for sharing. That mood I was after from the beginning. But I'll have to screw some things, there is not much time left.

Martin_x - Thanks!

Now, trying to work on the head. But not sure about the design??

[scott242]

Love the idea...its starting to look really nice. Not sure what you're going for with the head, but I think its moving in the right direction as far as looking strong and wise but not necessarily aggressive.

[TMNI VISION]

Waiting to see how you come up for the shell pattern/scale . Temple Looks nice . Keep it up .

[gestis]

Thank you for responce!

Looks like I'm running out of time, jeez. And this leg already have took so much time and still is not completed. :ugh:

[Fli 3D]

Looks great. Awesome concept. Can't wait to see this finished!

[Kaiune3D]

Updates are looking great love the horns

[makabukis]

Superinis vezlys!!!

[gestis]

I'll stop here with sculpting and hi-res modeling. Going to the next stage...

http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/8948/tortoise1.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/836/tortoise1.jpg/)

http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/3788/tortoise2.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/21/tortoise2.jpg/)

[Martin_x]

Beautiful piece! Best of luck with lowpoly.

[Pockets]

looks great. really great! keep it up :D

[Rytis]

ohh man ur turtle looks crazy as hell:D cool sculpt. i love it.
best luck with low poly

[wil_himura]

awesome result mate, will have a hard time making the low poly tho :S You're so close keep it up!!