Portrait

[OcheevaSithis]

I spend most of time at work, making low poly models for our casual game projects and so. On my spare times i spend some effort on a highpoly model. Photorealism is what i want to achieve so i spend some extra time on topology anatomy etc.

Whole model and topology has completed in 3ds max - poly editing tools. After then completing my base model i ll keep going on zbrush. My pipeline is kinda old school i know. But this is a hobby project and i love dealing with this.

there are still some proportional errors and topology issues, i ll rearrange those when whole portrait is completed.


hope you like it, its an early image for now however i ll be updating thread with new stuff

enjoy

// i listen sphongle while working. yummy it really helps alot

[paulius-st]

hi. dont want to insult the actual person you referenced but i miss some features in her face like : cheakbones, forhead and without them the face looks like this little fella (http://thewondrous.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Philippine-Tarsiers.jpg)
topology is good and modeling it self is quit good but check the edges betvien her eyes on her nose. i see some pinching. try to terminate some loops there cause it gets realy dence in this area and pinches are dificoult to handle that way.
and overlook the area straight above her eyes. its too flat and too sharp.
and for further updates a reference picture and a front view of your model would be nice.
good luck on further progress :)

[OcheevaSithis]

front view

[paulius-st]

you're wellcome :) . i see it starts to look better, but if you are going for likeness so i allready see some places you should fix in early stage to ceep likeness and ceep a nice edge flow.
soon i'll post a paintover to show you.

[OcheevaSithis]

you're wellcome :) . i see it starts to look better, but if you are going for likeness so i allready see some places you should fix in early stage to ceep likeness and ceep a nice edge flow.
soon i'll post a paintover to show you.

thanks i ll be waiting, sometimes i feel stucked like hanging around same places all the time and tweak stuff however it takes longer and longer then never ends. maybe i should keep going on neck-ears etc and leave further tweaking for zbrush? not sure yet, im looking forward to see your guidance, thank you :dance:

[OcheevaSithis]

one of the problems are these i guess..

[paulius-st]

well did a fast overpaint. i hope you'll undestand. in the side view i uotlined a silhuet of her face in realyty so you could see where you've gone wrong. her cheaks in real life are more chubey than in your model. and she has cheakbones that your model doesnt have. than her nose doesnt stand pout so much in real life ,whill looking at profile, than in your model. and dont forget her eyebrow area - i outlined it in the pic. than her nose hunch. she has it but your model doesnt. than nosdrills - she is not a elephant to have them so big. i outlined the actual size. your's are twice bigger than should.
now as for topology - the muzzle has wrong edge loops. i drew a green arrow to show how the main muzzle edge loop should go. i suggest you looking at the first image in topology thread as the main reference cause it has ideal topology.
then i saw this realy ugley polygon i even wrote on a picture that its bad. it causes pinching. cause it bends and even if its a simple 4 sided plane it creates a angle betvien its edges. i drew a doted blue line where you eventualy will get pinch . then i saw a triangle that messes your topology and edge flow. if you made it a quad then you would be able to fix the muzzle edge loops withe ease.
then i drew a green polygons on her nose as a suggestion how to terminate half of polygons in that dence area. but remember - its only a suggestion.
and this whole area needs some moving i made a little ilustration to show it.
ofcource i could redraw the whole topology to show how it should be made but sorry - have no time for this right now :( .
hope i was usefull. and sorry for bad gramar :)

[OcheevaSithis]

well did a fast overpaint. i hope you'll undestand. in the side view i uotlined a silhuet of her face in realyty so you could see where you've gone wrong. her cheaks in real life are more chubey than in your model. and she has cheakbones that your model doesnt have. than her nose doesnt stand pout so much in real life ,whill looking at profile, than in your model. and dont forget her eyebrow area - i outlined it in the pic. than her nose hunch. she has it but your model doesnt. than nosdrills - she is not a elephant to have them so big. i outlined the actual size. your's are twice bigger than should.
now as for topology - the muzzle has wrong edge loops. i drew a green arrow to show how the main muzzle edge loop should go. i suggest you looking at the first image in topology thread as the main reference cause it has ideal topology.
then i saw this realy ugley polygon i even wrote on a picture that its bad. it causes pinching. cause it bends and even if its a simple 4 sided plane it creates a angle betvien its edges. i drew a doted blue line where you eventualy will get pinch . then i saw a triangle that messes your topology and edge flow. if you made it a quad then you would be able to fix the muzzle edge loops withe ease.
then i drew a green polygons on her nose as a suggestion how to terminate half of polygons in that dence area. but remember - its only a suggestion.
and this whole area needs some moving i made a little ilustration to show it.
ofcource i could redraw the whole topology to show how it should be made but sorry - have no time for this right now :( .
hope i was usefull. and sorry for bad gramar :)

yeah i got all i ll keep working on those parts but hmm i ll been adding new polygons so now its too crowded, will be another challenge to fix :D but thanks a lot i ll be looking for solutions right now. THANKS ALOT! and np about grammar understood all

[OcheevaSithis]

okay i have cleaned the triangle but generated an pool insteads. pools may cause problems?

[paulius-st]

pools may cause problems?

not allways. its better to use them when you need to avoid triangles or change a direction of the edge flow or to reduce the dencity of the certain areas. and never use them in deformable areas.

[OcheevaSithis]

i have rebooted my pc and this happens :S:S:S why this happens.. and how to solve ... or should i fix it manually O_O

[OcheevaSithis]

and it doesnt matter which save or autoback i open...this happens in all files.. :S

[Tank[NL]]

i'm guessing you dont have older versions that work? always have ****loads of backups. can save you a lot of headaches.

as for this, i have no idea man. my instinct tell me to remove the modifiers and hand edit... :S

good luck

[OcheevaSithis]

darn.. its so so weird i mean i have loads of backups autobacks and so but doesnt matter which i open..all has this kind of results..its so so weird and annoying ... model was so soft now its so bumpy and deformed ........

[OcheevaSithis]

;864787']i'm guessing you dont have older versions that work? always have ****loads of backups. can save you a lot of headaches.

as for this, i have no idea man. my instinct tell me to remove the modifiers and hand edit... :S

good luck

okay i have started fixing it manually..but how may i sure .. what if this will happen again.. i ll save it as a FBX too or OBJ..

[paulius-st]

what version of max do you use.? i see people use symetry modifyer a lot that likes to F**k up models from time to time . i use mirror with clone set to be a instance and never ever get any bugs or problems and even get more control of my mirored clone. for egsample you can smooth one side and work on another and interactivly see the result :) .
as for your model try to turn off all modifyers leaving your model raw.
if nothing changes just upload your max file here (it would be awsome if it was 2010 version file :)) and i would take a look at it

[OcheevaSithis]

what version of max do you use.? i see people use symetry modifyer a lot that likes to F**k up models from time to time . i use mirror with clone set to be a instance and never ever get any bugs or problems and even get more control of my mirored clone. for egsample you can smooth one side and work on another and interactivly see the result :) .
as for your model try to turn off all modifyers leaving your model raw.
if nothing changes just upload your max file here (it would be awsome if it was 2010 version file :)) and i would take a look at it

its an 2010 file i have started a massive reconstruction progress now. probably because of symmetry-turbosmooth thing. because if i remember right i had this kind of an error before too. it was a model with turbosmooth and symmetry again.. mostly i work with models only with symmetry and no turbosmooth so never got such a bug but now with turbosmooth im punching my doors and walls:D

here is the ruined one...hope you can heal it. i m almost done with reconstruction but had to use relax tool so i ve lost loads of little details...
uploading to rapidshare takes ages and cannot upload it here cuz of file size limit. but i can email it to you if u can spare ur address with me.

thanks a lot.

[paulius-st]

ok. PM'ed you my e-mail .

[OcheevaSithis]

ok. PM'ed you my e-mail .

okay sending the file right now thanks a lot. hope there is a chance

[paulius-st]

ok. took a look at it. i can say you're F**ked by those modifyers. if you have a previous save of your model that works and has the details you can remodel the last progress . and if you have zbrsuh so i would load your last working model and upload as subtool the currupted one. than i would save the good model as morph target and then select your currupted model's tool and with morph brush set to low value fix the deformed areas . and than export your model as obj .
and i have a suggestion - never use a edit poly modifyer if you dont realy need it. i would convert your model in to a edit poly and then model further with turbosmooth aplyed.
here is my workflow that has never let me down.
after i create a plane i allways convert it to edit poly and without any modifyers i use edge extrude to model some base geo and than i use miror tool to make a instance of the model and i aply a turbosmooth modifyer and work with "show end resul turned on".
this way i only have one modifyer in the stack and never ever get any mesh corruptions or other problems. and the workflow is realy fast this way(about 1-2 hours for a characters head). and when i need other side to become a part of my mesh i just convert it to edit poly -> atatch and weld veerticies or create new ones by bridging sides.

[OcheevaSithis]

ok. took a look at it. i can say you're F**ked by those modifyers. if you have a previous save of your model that works and has the details you can remodel the last progress . and if you have zbrsuh so i would load your last working model and upload as subtool the currupted one. than i would save the good model as morph target and then select your currupted model's tool and with morph brush set to low value fix the deformed areas . and than export your model as obj .
and i have a suggestion - never use a edit poly modifyer if you dont realy need it. i would convert your model in to a edit poly and then model further with turbosmooth aplyed.
here is my workflow that has never let me down.
after i create a plane i allways convert it to edit poly and without any modifyers i use edge extrude to model some base geo and than i use miror tool to make a instance of the model and i aply a turbosmooth modifyer and work with "show end resul turned on".
this way i only have one modifyer in the stack and never ever get any mesh corruptions or other problems. and the workflow is realy fast this way(about 1-2 hours for a characters head). and when i need other side to become a part of my mesh i just convert it to edit poly -> atatch and weld veerticies or create new ones by bridging sides.

thanks alot for all your effort mate. im working with my model again fixing parts and remodeling it.. but now i want to take a break and deep breath i ll continue tomorrow :D geez..

[OcheevaSithis]

ok. took a look at it. i can say you're F**ked by those modifyers. if you have a previous save of your model that works and has the details you can remodel the last progress . and if you have zbrsuh so i would load your last working model and upload as subtool the currupted one. than i would save the good model as morph target and then select your currupted model's tool and with morph brush set to low value fix the deformed areas . and than export your model as obj .
and i have a suggestion - never use a edit poly modifyer if you dont realy need it. i would convert your model in to a edit poly and then model further with turbosmooth aplyed.
here is my workflow that has never let me down.
after i create a plane i allways convert it to edit poly and without any modifyers i use edge extrude to model some base geo and than i use miror tool to make a instance of the model and i aply a turbosmooth modifyer and work with "show end resul turned on".
this way i only have one modifyer in the stack and never ever get any mesh corruptions or other problems. and the workflow is realy fast this way(about 1-2 hours for a characters head). and when i need other side to become a part of my mesh i just convert it to edit poly -> atatch and weld veerticies or create new ones by bridging sides.

yeah at office i was working on a mode and again such a thing happent this time i only had editpoly then turbosmooth. but mostly i do turn on-off turbosmooth while working with edit poly so if i use show result on/off this would not happen? i hope so, im re arranging my model again