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Old 01-02-2010, 11:07 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by rocneasta View Post
speaking of challenges since they are now pushed to one month, would it be possible to let's say make another test run of animation challenge. Even if the prizes were just 3D T-shirt (which is priceless) or a forum insignia until you can see if it's worth continuing...
Do you think there are people willing to do this?
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Old 01-02-2010, 11:16 PM   #17
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Well i can only speak on my behalf when i say that i am willing to try it, even if i'm never animated stuff other than placing an object on one and setting the first keyframe then playing it from 0 to that key

communities are to exchange knowledge, and for me it's the best way to learn. One advice from someone involved in the animation to me is equivalent of 5 different fully explained books - if people don't see things this way, then well either they are motivated by prizes alone, or animation is not their game

not trying to judge anyone, just saying it perhaps wouldn't be such a waste of time, might prove to raise knowledge bar of people that take part and get critique and comments, in the end perhaps it might prove to become a good challenge to take part in. Especially since you have a month to take part, and might even serve as the final phase after let's say modeling/sculpting challenge - just transition your models there if it's applicable and animate it the way it should be...

in a nutshell challenge to me is a way to broaden the skill, knowledge and awareness of mistakes, flaws and advantages. Would be nice if more people participated in C&C but community started to grow with the new challenges and talent so we might even see that happen
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Old 02-02-2010, 06:19 AM   #18
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I am not familiar with any other voting system since I have not looked at other monthly comps much, so to that respect this question might be very silly. However, I can't seem to understand how an anonymous voting system will prevent people from creating new accounts to add more votes. What exactly do you mean by anonymous voting? Is it a PM to the moderator or is it that voting poll system you see on many sites?

The only clear advantage in public voting is that we can all see that the people who have voted are people who have been here for a while and we respect their opinion and share ours. Art only gets better through criticism and we all have to face it throughout our lives. Personally I love the people who leave notes along with their vote, I think everyone should be asked to do this. It shows some reason and thought put into the decision, and the feedback can help with artists getting better. To be honest, It seems like the 3Dtotal community spirit is taking a beating just for a few ebooks and a t-shirt. This is just my opinion and you are free to disagree, but if I didn't place in one of the 5 spots, I'd like to see why I didn't get votes as opposed to wait until the final judgment is made and have no idea of general response to my work. Did I get at least 1 vote? Who was it? Was it an experienced artist? Maybe I can ask him why he liked it? And to the same degree ask what people didn't like about it who didn't vote. Perhaps this was the idea behind open voting.

As to the topic of texturing/normal maps/background models; I mentioned before that I think there should only be clay and wireframe submissions. Reason being that these are the ones being counted in final voting and that should match with public voting. If you wish to have any beauty submissions then let them be with procedural or solid colour materials like Rachel said in her post.
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Old 02-02-2010, 06:28 AM   #19
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czacen i hate to believe that motive behind saying "no public vote" are the prizes or if someone didn't win...

public voting issue is all about presentation and less about rules and modeling - since there are loads of ways to present a 3D art

you can either model every little detail or just get a rough model out and bump everything else with maps - the end result is this. the modeler who can't texture will have an unfinished model and the fella that knows how to texture will get a better review of his work. this is only a problem not because of the prizes it's because this should be and remain a speed modeling competition, not speed working your way around modeling.

now the public vote didn't discourage me from taking part in the community nor in the challenges ahead. it's just my humble opinion and i don't like it. it's not objective as the judging was - i had much more profound sense of quality then when the judged art is the ones voted on

no hard feelings
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Old 02-02-2010, 06:40 AM   #20
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I think we are both saying the same thing rocneasta. I agree with you about overpresentation with use of eyecandy topping (check my post here). however I think that 'InTheClue' is raising the issue popularity based voting, and how if a senior votes for an entry then all the other voters will follow him. To be honest this is just nonsense. The purpose of the open vote is to judge for yourself whether the work you have done is appealing to a broad community. It is always valuable as an artist to know where you stand with your work. No one is saying that the 3D total community is the gospel of 3D art and that if they dont vote then you need to stop competing. Like I said I think you and I are saying the same thing. So no hard feelings a all
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Old 02-02-2010, 07:34 AM   #21
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I agree with most of my mates, regarding to votes and regarding to the beauty shots issue.

I think as this is a speed modelling, we should show only the models wires+ clay.

And, I have an idea, should every month the judges be chosen, as other contests do. For example, at the beginning of the month, 3d total announces ...dunno, 4 or 5 judges, that can go from 3dt staff members to respected professionals/members form 3dtotal, that will vote according to the voting rules (originality, quality of the modelling ... ).
It's only an idea, don't know if you agree with that, but I think is the fairest way.

Of course we can always do some kind of... secret voting?
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Old 02-02-2010, 08:23 AM   #22
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+1 for a an animationchallenge(doesnt have to include prices - the award is enough). im done learning to model thanks to the smcs. now i need to learn animation, cause i have absolutely no clue about it.
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Old 02-02-2010, 09:42 AM   #23
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Hi All,

Thanks for all of your feedback, here's the point of view from 3DTotal.

The best thing for us about the public voting is that it helps us with something we are very short of - 'time' - basically it allows the forum members to help us with a big judging job. We are under pressure with our projects that pay the bills, books, mags, site etc and running the challenges is a real task for us (in time and expenses) when you consider all of the admin, prizes, organization etc.

So with the public voting, then at least the whole team has to only evaluate the top 5 that have gone through from each stream, so 25 in total, if you look at the results you will notice that we all give comments etc and it's quite a job.

The only thing I can think of right now (suggested by BT) is that the head moderator who runs the challenge chooses the top 5, and then we have the panel vote on these.

Or if anyone else has any suggestions to solve this problem, or help us out with the 'time' issue then please let us know

Many thanks

Tom
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Old 02-02-2010, 10:09 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by Tom-3DT View Post

The only thing I can think of right now (suggested by BT) is that the head moderator who runs the challenge chooses the top 5, and then we have the panel vote on these.
That seems at least a good idea to try Tom.

Thanks for listening to the masses
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Old 02-02-2010, 10:12 AM   #25
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Yeah I second that.
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Old 02-02-2010, 10:16 AM   #26
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Old 02-02-2010, 10:24 AM   #27
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So does the public want their opinion to be null and that one person choose the top 5?
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Old 02-02-2010, 10:33 AM   #28
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Threedy Top Poster - Bronze: Contributing to the forums with 100+ posts - Issue reason: Target reached! Speed Modelling - Gold: Winner of a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: Winner of a speed modelling challenge! Speed Modelling - Gold: Winner of a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: Winner of a speed modelling challenge! Speed Modelling - Silver: 2nd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: 2nd place in a speed modelling challenge week 38 ''triped'' Speed Modelling - Silver: 2nd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: 2nd place in a speed modelling challenge week 52 ''It's our birthday'' 
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Originally Posted by Freespace-3DT View Post
So does the public want their opinion to be null and that one person choose the top 5?
sounds like most here wants someone to blame for the results of the challenges :P

instead blaming & flaming each other..

lol
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Old 02-02-2010, 11:10 AM   #29
czacen
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Threedy Top Poster - Bronze: Contributing to the forums with 100+ posts - Issue reason: 100 posts Speed Modelling - Silver: 2nd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: 2nd place in a speed modelling challenge # 03 Speed Modelling - Bronze: 3rd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason:  
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Originally Posted by Freespace-3DT View Post
So does the public want their opinion to be null and that one person choose the top 5?
Just my opinion, but I feel this is going to ruin the community spirit of these comps. Whats the use in even making wip threads? We might as well just post the images at the end of the month with 2 WIPs and the final piece. Since it doesnt really matter what people think along the way. Why would I even need to see any one else's thread since It doesnt matter to the final judging? All this will do is make everyone more solitary on the threads. I might be looking at this a little extreme, but I for one would like these comps to last for the learning and fun factor and not be lost because some guy who never took part in the comps stirred up a riot.

Like I said this opinion might be extreme, but I for one have no issue with the current system of voting.
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Old 02-02-2010, 11:41 AM   #30
pables
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Thumbs up!:  - Issue reason: For doing a great job in helping out! Speed Modelling - Gold: Winner of a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: Winner of a speed modelling challenge No.057 Speed Modelling - Gold: Winner of a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: Winner of a speed modelling challenge! Speed Modelling - Silver: 2nd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: 2nd place in a speed modelling challenge! Speed Modelling - Silver: 2nd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: 2nd place in a speed modelling challenge! Speed Modelling - Bronze: 3rd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: 3rd place in a speed modelling challenge! Speed Modelling - Bronze: 3rd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: 3rd place in a speed Modelling Challenge ''Walk this way'' Speed Modelling - Bronze: 3rd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: 3rd place in a speed modelling challenge! Speed Modelling - Bronze: 3rd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: 3rd place in a speed modelling challenge! Speed Modelling - Bronze: 3rd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: 3rd place in a speed Modelling Challenge Speed Modelling - Bronze: 3rd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: 3rd place in a speed Modelling Challenge Speed Modelling - Bronze: 3rd place in a speed modelling challenge! - Issue reason: 3rd place in a speed Modelling Challenge #24  
Total Awards: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Freespace-3DT View Post
So does the public want their opinion to be null and that one person choose the top 5?
Said that way sound strange, but yes. Cause we trust in threedy mods, and we know they're gonna vote fairly, objectively and taking into account the points that were supposed to count for voting. (ex. good modelling, time, originality of design...)


This are comps, ok, but this is mainly for fun and maybe eventually win something, and we don't want to watch them disappear for some people being too competitive between mates, I think it its better if a fair judge chooses the top five each month according to the rules. I trust in threedy mods.

Ps, and, we only try to make threedy speedies the best. If a new voting system is introduced and doesn't work, we can always choose a new method that fits better.

Last edited by pables; 02-02-2010 at 11:46 AM..
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